Bear0501

Im new here. Been around plenty of guns but I have acquired a Armsport Inc, Made In Italy Black Powder Kentuckian Rifle 45cal. Model 5 111.and I can not find one anywhere to compare mine to. Age/how many made,value,etc. Appreciate all the help I can get,thanks.

tx gun runner

Welcome from TX

Armsport is a importer only . Most of there guns are NOT high dollar guns and are made by different companies around the world . They are normally great shooters . The barrel twist will tell you if it is a round ball shooter it will be around 1 in 66 , most guns are 1 in 48 which will shoot round ball but will shoot slugs better if you don't try to drive them to fast . Stuff like sabots like 1 in 24 or 30 twist . I hope this helps you .

north country gal

Welcome to the forum, Bear. As TGR says, Armsport was an importer and there were lots of those around after the big resurgence of interest in muzzleloaders hit back in the 70s and 80s. Most of those guns were made in Spain or in Italy, as with yours.

Don't want to sound negative, but, right now, the market for used imported traditional MLs is about zilch unless it is one of the premier makers like Pedersoli and, even, then, a lot of gunshots still won't take them in on trade. The market for these traditional Kentucky and Hawkens was originally driven by guys who were using them for hunting, but nearly all of those users have moved on to inlines and sabot guns, so a lot of these used traditional MLs have flooded the market. It's so bad that even the market for US made traditionals like the TCs has died. No problem at all to get a mint condition TC Hawkens in our area for $200. It's a shame, because these are all still very shootable guns.

The good news is that a few of us, here, still shoot these traditionals and/or appreciate them for the neat guns they are. Being that I am a diehard pistol shooter, about the only rifles I do shoot, anymore, are these traditional MLs.

This one is a Pedersoli Frontier in 50 cal. You can still buy these new for $700 plus, but I got it used with a flintlock conversion kit for much less. Very accurate gun with either round ball or conicals. Not for sale.



Here are two TC Hawkens with original, very hard to find, factory peep sights. The top one, which I still have, is an early vintage 45 cal pre-warning, 70s vintage gun, which makes it a bit more collectible in the eyes of TC fans. The bottom is a later 50 cal TC Hawkens which I sold for about $250 and felt pretty good about it.



The one exception to the low prices and low demand for traditionals are the hard to find traditionals like this TC Seneca in 45 cal. The Senecas were never made in great numbers and after the fire hit the TC plant in 1996, they were discontinued, along with the even smaller Cherokee. TC fans love these smaller MLs, though, and are still willing to pay big prices for them. I paid $400 for this 45 cal Seneca and that was cheap. Absolute joy to shoot, though. Not for sale, either.

tx gun runner

NCG ... I was trying to sugar coating it till I ask how much he paid for it . My son shot single trigger 50 cal 1 in 48 for over 10 year in matches and he didn't like the TC Renagade 50 I got for him .

north country gal

I've done pretty well with the 1 in 48s. Like you say, though, just a matter of trying to find that sweet spot as far as velocity and projectile. Now, when I want to go heavy, I just grab the Encore 209x50. With the pistol, I'm up in 454 Casull territory.

Might be awhile before I shoot anything outside, though. This was enough to get me out on the skis, this morning. Patch, our English Setter and I had a ball. Our collie took one step in the snow and stepped right back, inside. What a wuss! Anyway, GREAT to be back on the skis. I'm in heaven, once again. By tomorrow night, supposed to have a total of 16 inches, so another ten to go. Yipeee! Let it snow, let it snow, let it snow.

Dennis H

I fear those long, cold, snowy winters may have gotten to u ncg!!

north country gal

Not to worry, Dennis. My Norwegian blood protects me. It's in my genes.

Dennis H

Lol! I got it too! Why I hate it when it gets above 70!

Bear0501

Thanks for all the info. I have not found any of these rifles for sale for a reference . I was thinking maybe in the 400-500 ?

Bear0501

Going to try to get a picture posted here.

tx gun runner

That is 2X more snow then I got in my part of Tx in 5 yrs total . I happy for you since you love the snow . That cold air has come down to hit us too . Nomally we are in the 70's till Jan and the weather man said the high for this week will be in the 50's I guess no short and tee shirt this week or MC riding .

north country gal

If it hit the 50s, here, we would be wearing shorts and riding motorcycles.