Machinist

I think that just means if the shipper loses the order you need to make a claim against them, not the seller. This is normal and common.

rojasj

I gotcha. I'll call luckygunner and ask. That just sort of freaked me out.

north country gal

Yes, any shotgun made within the last 15 years or so can easily handle steel shot. Some old doubles and vintage guns with softer steel in the barrels had problems with steel bulging the chokes but, even then, the problem wasn't as widespread as commonly believed. You are good to go with steel.

You shouldn't have to be ordering shotgun ammo on line. I know there's been a big rush on ammo, but you should be able to find just about anything in 12 gauge ammo at local gun shops. Wal-marts in urban areas probably won't have much of a selection, but the Wal-mart in our rural area actually has a decent selection.

tx gun runner

The 870 made in the last 20 yrs are safe for steel if the choke say ok for steel . Personally if I shoot steel I use a choke that chokes outside the barrel . DON"T FORGET THE CHOKE GREASE .

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/184...choke-12-gauge

rojasj

Thanks, believe it or not ammo availability in northern, NJ is rather dry and that includes 12 gauge 22LR is nowhere to be seen.

rojasj

Uhmm.. stupid question here. What's a choke and how do I know if my 870 has on or not.

tx gun runner

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Rtpzk1HLzk

Machinist

Not stupid at all. A shotgun barrel is a straight tube most of the way out but towards the end there is usually a restriction or narrower area to make the shot stay together longer as it travels away from the barrel. This can be integral with the barrel or it can be in the form of changeable choke tubes that are either threaded inside the barrel as shown in Gunrunner's video or externally mounted. Double barrel shotguns may have different chokes in each barrel, one being for closer shots and the other more restrictive for a longer shot.

I won't go into more detail as there are people here far more knowledgeable about it than I am. They will give you better advice.

north country gal

The only shotgun barrels without a choke are labeled "cylinder" (not to be confused with improved cylinder). "Cylinder" is the traditional open bore, no choke barrel for use with buckshot at close range, typically found on "riot" shotguns. You want that pattern to open ASAP for tactical work.

Okay, here I go on a bit of a rant, but I think anyone who uses a shotgun for home defense needs to consider a few things. It could save your life.

For self-defense purposes of 15 or 20 feet, the choke on your 870 is basically irrelevant because at that distance, we're really dealing with a ball of shot, more or less, regardless of choke. That's just not enough distance to open up a pattern to any appreciable size - something to think about. The pray and spray and sweep a room clean with a shotgun you see on TV and the movies is basically a myth.

Take your shotgun out and see what it does against a piece of cardboard at 15 feet - the width of an average room in the house. That will prove quite revealing. It will explain more than anything I can say why you're going to have to do more than just point a shotgun in the general direction of an attacker in your home and just shoot. A shotgun as a self-defense weapon is not the just point and hit anything weapon that so many mistakenly believe it to be. It really irks me to see some people advise arming someone with a shotgun if they can't use a revolver. A shotgun is no cure all weapon.

Forget that shooting from the hip nonsense. Get that shotgun up to your shoulder, focus on the spot you want to hit, point (not aim) the barrel and fire and then pump, immediately. The pumping should become automatic after every shot and the only way to get that down as a habit is to practice. In a life threatening situation, you'll want that second shot ready to go in case you need it. An attacker won't wait, politely, for you to rack in that second or third round. Get out and practice with your shotgun, same as you would with a pistol.

Of course, we all pray we will never need such a skill and the vast majority of us never will, but if you are going to all the trouble to keep a shotgun in the house for this very purpose, no excuse not to know how to use it.

303Lithgow

I bought a Norico replica WWI trench gun and agree with NCG about the distances. I took carboard out to the range just like she said and was shocked at the small pattern at room length distances. I practice shootin' from the hip and can do it but it takes a lot of practice.

This may sound strange but I don't own firearms for self defense as my primary objective. I own firearms for national defense of our right to do so. I'm more scared of uncle sam then I am of thugs. I also think the entire herd gets protection when more law abiding citizen are carrying. So with that though I want everyone to carry and would like to see more open carry.

rojasj

Thanks for the explanation, I appreciate it. I know that the pray and spray sweep is a myth and that at close range shotgun ammo is traveling as if it were one big ball of lead.

Next time I go to the range I'll setup a target with maybe a thawed turkey to see what the #8 shot will do at 10-15 feet. I'm sure the it will do more than just "annoy the turkey".

I tried two shots from the hip and quickly realized that the shotgun is designed to be on my shoulder and nowhere else. At least for me it just feels much more comfortable on my shoulder.

I also pray that I'll never have to use it in a defensive position but as you said I have to practice...practice..practice. Today would have been a perfect day to go to the range but all my shooting buddies want to watch the "Superbowl" thing. Not me, I follow triathlons, bike racing and marathons.

rojasj

I agree 100% more and more citizens should own firearms and I really wish I could carry in NJ.

Not to stir any controversy but while I was in the waiting are at our seven year old daughters dance class three moms were openly discussing the fact that all guns should be banned as they are not necessary. They asked my opinion and I was honest. I told them that I would agree with them 100% if they can each prove to me that they can defended their families against an intruder or intruders or a car jacking or assault with "bad words" while they wait for the police. I mean those bad words really are intimidating and hurt my feeling so so bad. That stopped the "conversation" in it's tracks.

303Lithgow

That is not entirely true. The shipping company has no contract with the buyer but does with the seller/ shipper as they are the ones that paid for the service. So the shipper needs to file the claim. What their disclaimer means is that if the shipping company doesn't pull through they will not be replace it.

But don't be concered as the shipping companies would not survive if they didn't made good. I was an expeditor for decades and have filed hundreds of claims over the years and although some were a hassle the shipping company ALLWAYS paid.

tx gun runner

I use this gun in SASS/CAS matches it has 18" barrels and screw in chokes which both are improved cylinder and great for the knocking down steel targets . I custom make my 12Ga shells with 3/4 oz of 7 1/2 shot and 12gr of Unique powder which kicks a little harder then a 410 . .

RetiredSeabee

TGR you have way too many beautiful guns. And I am jealous. Thanks for sharing them with us.

303Lithgow

He has one of the best collections that I've ever seen. Love his photography too.

rojasj

Here's a good video that I found on penetration testing. No slugs for my house.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_v1a9rPyRBk

tx gun runner

I like #6 if they do go threw the wall there is not much poop on them

goosecommander

You need to check out www.shotgunpatternpro.com they specialize in shotguns, ballistics, chokes, self defense, etc.. Thanks and good luck.